Shop Mobile More Submit  Join Login
Occupy Wall Street 21 by Radio-Schizo Occupy Wall Street 21 by Radio-Schizo
Occupy Wall St. protests - October 5, 2011.
Add a Comment:
 
:iconmadam--kitty:
Madam--Kitty Featured By Owner Sep 11, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist

Hi. wanna join my group called Anti-illuminati-01? anti-illuminati-01.deviantart.…

P.S. The group is about politics in case you were wondering.

Reply
:iconashkinmor:
Ashkinmor Featured By Owner Dec 18, 2013
Spoiled teenagers who live in the First world. A comfortable living standard. They never have known poverty, never have known hunger, never have known true oppression. I wish we could send them to Myanmar and give them an education in what greed, power, and corruption really looks like.
Reply
:iconkomatsuzaki-xingqi:
Komatsuzaki-Xingqi Featured By Owner Jul 5, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Yeah! Put the rich people to death! The CEO's! The doctors and lawyers and pilots! Shame on them for making all that money by the sweat of their brow! Why can't people who do nothing but look at porn on 4chan, play Call of Duty, and eat potato chips and beer all day make that much money?

Death to income inequality! Obama is our God now!
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Jul 8, 2013
death to bronies.
Reply
Flagged as Spam
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 24, 2011
I just deleted one comment because I just copy/pasted some random nonsense from some Black Metal kook because I was in a bad mood and didn't feel like having to sit down and talk politics. But hey, if you're curious, heres what I posted:

"Once upon a time, in another world and another place out there in space.

I was young and curious, sought and searched for answers to the most unbelievable questions. I grew up in a noble family and was educated to become a knight. I traveled far and searched for honour and fame - like all knights do. I found both, but I never found happiness. There was too much injustice and cruelty out there for me to be happy. It is only the fools who are happy.

Famous and honoured as I was, I thought it my duty to end all injustice in the world. I knew it was the gods who were behind this and therefore decided that I should find them and crave answers to why they were so cruel and unfair. Why they let young boys get cut down on the fields of battle; why they let innocent infants die of disease in the crib; why they let plague and sickness ravage; why they let some live like slaves their whole life, only to die filthy and old in their beds. Why were they so cruel?

With my big headed ego I therefore one early morning trampled down to the most wise man in my home-town. I hammered impudent on the door with an iron glove and announced loud and clear that I wanted his service.

"Where are the gods?"

He was (dressed in a nightgown) astonished, not only by my bearing, but also by my question.

"Where are the gods?"

He repeated my question to himself. He pointed towards the heavens and said:

"There!"

"But I want to talk to them. I have a question for them. Are they never here on earth?"

"It is a long time ago since the gods wandered among us."

He bade me indoors and his servant (who also had been aroused by the commotion) served us food and drinks.

"There once was a time when the gods themselves wandered on earth. They descended from the heavens in their shining wagons and altered everything that existed. Mankind was destroying the whole world. They had burned or cut down all the forest, they had fished all the fish in the sea, they had killed all the animals that existed and the soil which they grew grain on was emaciated. There were too many humans, and all had become bandits. The smoke from the chimneys polluted the rain and made it dangerous to drink. The ocean, lakes and rivers died. The growth and plants, birds and animals that were not already dead because of the humans died too. Even the humans got trouble with breathing the air, which because of the funeral pyres was thick and heavy.

The gods therefore descended to make order. To give life back to our planet. They burned the cities and slaughtered humans in tens of thousands. Lightning and flames rained down upon the fleeing masses. The sea washed up on the land and pulled humans back with it into the deep. The wind blew them away and crushed them against the ground. Mountains collapsed, some over the cities. The whole world lay in ruins. Ashes, mud and rocks, sea and glowing lava had covered everything. Only vestiges of the old world peered over it.

The gods then created a new world and let some people from the old world live there, but to prevent that the humans again demolished the earth they placed Guardians among them. Thereafter the gods traveled back to the heavens. No one has seen them ever since."

"But I must speak with the gods. I must meet them"

"Then you must speak to a Guardian. Find a Guardian. Perhaps he can help you?"

"Where are these Guardians? How may I get a hold of them?"

That I do not know. They are invisible. They only see, they can not be seen."

Once again I ventured out in the world, not to win honour and fame, but to confront the gods with their wrong doings. I intended to march into Valhalla itself and point accusingly at Odin, while I put forth my allegations, questions and criticism. "Why are you so unfair and cruel? Why!?" Very content with my noble goal I therefore left to find a Guardian. I searched high and low, in old ruins from the old world, in high towers and deep caverns, in murky forests and over wild seas. There were no Guardians to find. No one who knew where the gods were. No roads ascending to the heavens.

I was traveling for many years. One follower after another felt down. Some were killed in combat against goblins and trolls, dragons and bandits, other fell like rocks down from high mountains and walls, some were victims of plague and sickness, others just died. I do not even remember anymore how and why they all died. There were so many in the end. My anger only increased. My aggression towards the gods only accelerated in strength. They did not even care to give me an answer!

In the end I lay there on the ground myself, wounded and dying. Exhausted and weary, dejected and in despair. It all had been without meaning. Without a solution. Without an answer. Without a cause. It all was going to end in the mud, where I lay. Bloody and vile. Alone among dead humans that I soon were to join.

It was then that I saw her. A fair being on a white horse. Smiling, almost laughing, she slowly rode towards me. My vision was double, the horse had eight legs. She laughed at me:

"Hold on if you can."

I did not understand what was happening, everything was so unreal. But, somehow I got up on my legs, and suddenly I was sitting there behind her on the horseback. The horse galloped away as soon as I got a grip around her. In my condition it was not easy to gather everything that happened, but it seemed as we were riding upwards, upwards and ever upwards. Towards the heavens. I clenched to hold on. It went so fast. After a while I hung in a vertical position after the horse. The hands clenched around the hips of the fair woman, but I lost the grip ever more. I cried out. In despair, but also with the hope that she would help me. But she did not help me.

"Hold on if you can."

She nearly grinned it to me again, teasing. There was no compassion, no help. Nothing. I screamed and screamed. I lost my grip around her hips and slid slowly backwards, with my fingers at the horses back and behind. In the end I hung after the horse's tail. Straight out behind it, on its wild race over the heavens.

Everything was silent. There was no other sound but my own screams, and the woman's teasing "Hold on if you can" that rung back and forth in my head. It was not cold, nor warm. I was no longer heavy in my body, but nor was it light. Time somehow stood still. We only rode towards the light up there. Silently. I do not know how long it all lasted. The light enclosed us entirely after a while and the horse began riding downwards again. But I could not endure anymore, I had no strength left. I could not hang on anymore and let go. No! No! No!

But suddenly there I was. I had let go even as we landed. I lay on the ground. The horse stood there. The woman - still smiling and teasing. More fair men and woman assembled. They were so light they shined. Not fair as us, but even lighter.

"Bring him here" I heard one of them say.


II

"Where am I?" I heard myself say. I was in the process of waking up. There was somebody there.

"You have arrived" said a voice.

I opened my eyes and saw that I was in a large room. The walls, the ceiling, the floor and furniture were all white. Soft and white. Comfortable white. The sheet was also white. A fantastic beautiful woman stood there with a clever smile. "I shall announce that you are awake" she said and left the room.

My mail coat, sword and gloves, pants and everything else I had brought lay beside the bed on a white stool. Newly washed and cleaned, repaired and in good condition. I searched my body and understood that it as well had been repaired. The wounds were healed. There was not even a scar to see, and no bandages.

The door opened again and a woman peeked in. "You may come now" she said. "Get dressed and come out." I wanted to ask her how long I had slept, but she was too fast and closed the door. I dressed and remembered why I was here.

Outside the door a corridor led me down to a large door. The woman that escorted me said to me that "Now you are here." As if she new why I was here. I swallowed heavily and braved myself to knock on the door. She smiled at me as I peeked at her uncertainly. "Come in" it sounded. What else could I do?

A vast hall opened itself before me. Straight ahead there was a large throne, wherein Odin himself sat. Around him sat and stood many other gods, in a crescent towards me. They were all fair and wonderful, tall and healthy. They had no faults. No visible flaws. Some bore serious facial expressions, other smiled at me. Even Odin smiled too. "Now, what does this young sir want?" he said with a false sounding strict voice. He still smiled. I felt rather small where I stood. My great ego was suddenly not that great anymore. My great self-confidence was suddenly not so great anymore.

"Well" it nearly peeped out of me.

"According to my papers you have an accusation towards us" said Odin, and demonstratively flipped through some papers. He acted irritated, but even so gave me a feeling of security and confidence. Nothing could go wrong here. Here was nothing to fear. I was safe.

And so it came, the accusation. In detail. I told about how unfair life was for some people, how cruel for others, how undeserved certain people found happiness and how undeserved others did not. I spat out one accusation after the other to a patient gathering of gods, and ended my prosecution with a why!? Odin was not stirred. Nor any of the other gods seemed stirred.

"You ask us hard questions. To answer them I must know what you already know about earth and life on earth. For example, do you know whence the humans come?"

"Yes I do. We are your children. We are the children of the gods."

"And whence do you think the water spirits come, or the fairies and dragons, goblins and trolls?"

"I do not know."

"Let me tell you a story" said Odin. "A long story, that you might not understand."

"Try me." I had won back my self-confidence.

"There was a time when neither goblin nor troll, dragons or fairies existed. Only men and animals, only plants and mountains, ocean and heaven. Mankind had wagons to pull themselves, they had tamed vast birds that flew about in the wide world. They had dwarves forge them food, so they needed neither fields nor farmers. They raised towers that nearly reached the sky, and delved caverns so deep the flames from the inner earth came out and burned them. Ashes and smoke poured out and enveloped the cities. The animals got lost in the darkness of the smoke. The fish in the sea drowned. Birds fell as rain from the heavens, gaunt and lifeless - some with humans on their backs. Plants decayed and the earth was no longer fertile. Mankind had forgotten the gods"

"It was then that you descended and destroyed the old world?" I interrupted.

"Yes, it was then we had to descend and destroy the world of men. Because they had forgotten why they were on the earth and why they were humans. They had forgotten what they were to become and who's children they were. They married animals and had children with them. In the end there were almost no humans left; they had all mixed with animals. Only some few people were left, but also these lived like animals. It was but a matter of time before all our children would completely disappear. We had to intervene."

"But with so much cruelty? Did you have to let mountains fall over the cities? Did you have to let the ocean swallow the human masses? Did you have to let the flames burn those who were left? I have myself seen towers from the earliest times, that jag up from the earth. They are still black with soot on the inside. How many had to die?"

"It is often that someone must die so that others may live. The earth is created for our children, for humans, and all other creatures, animals and plants, fish and fowl, everything is created by us for the humans. So that man could live and grow. It was us who created the earth, it was us who placed her where she is now, between the warmth of the sun and the chill of space. We do with our creation as we want. What we have created we have the right to destroy as we see fit."

"But what about men? What about your own children? Have you no concern for them, no compassion or good wishes?"

"Children are unruleable. They often do what they themselves want, and not what their parents ask them to. What we did was to save our last surviving children from extinction, by forcing them to live differently. By forcing them to live like they should. By forcing them on to that road that leads ahead. By forcing them on the right road. We took some of the animals and from them we created new species and races. We created trolls, large, strong and stupid, to force men to fear the forest. We created goblins to give them something to varnish themselves on. The goblins are uncomfortable when they think, they therefore prefer the fight, because then they do not need to think. They hate the humans because they are themselves fallen humans. They are ugly and small, dark and foul, violent and dangerous, stupid and unwitted. But they have a purpose, like trolls, dragons and other creatures they force men to noble deed. We replaced the old and sick world with a world that gave humans a chance to become something more."

"That does not explain why you let young boys die before they get the taste of the fruits of love! Why you let infants die of sickness in their cribs, why you..."

"Yes, yes" He interrupted me. "Yes, it does explain all this too. Mankind needs to be strong, to face future challenges it must be strong. Is it then so wrong to let the weakest die, so that in fact the rest has an opportunity to survive the future? If everyone were to live everyone would die. Now only the weakest die, so the rest may live. And how noble are not the youth that storm forth and crash down dead on the battlefield before they have even tasted the fruits of love? Would the rest of the world ever know how good blood their family had, if not these boys had proved it with their noble deed? Would their mothers ever get the chance to refine their consciousness without this loss of a son? Is not the good man a man who has taught himself to tackle pain and to be able to imagine others'? Women's tears are like red gold; her pain refines her consciousness.

All the pain and suffering, all the hardness we put you through is to your own good. Without this you would once again become low life, without this you would again let the stupid and weak decide the development of the world. Without war it is impossible to unveil the cowards, and because of that the cowards get as much to say as the brave if there are no wars. Man becomes coward, mixes with animals and forgets the gods and the creed of the gods. What are we then to do with men, we have after all created them for a reason. We have created them so they shall become better, not so they shall become animals.

Look around, look at us. We are your parents. We created you. We want like other parents that you shall become like us. Just as beautiful, just as intelligent, just as strong, just as good, just as honest, just as tall, just as fair, just as creative, just as brave. You can become what I am, but then you must do as I tell you to. You must understand the necessity of the tests we put you through. No beauty comes without pain. No strength comes without hardness. Nothing noble spawns without misery."

"But why have you not told this to us? How was I supposed to know that everything that happens, no matter how gruesome and unfair it may seem, has a meaning?"

"It has no purpose. That you must understand yourselves. That is a part of our goal with you, that you shall learn to think for yourselves. You must understand on your own, without us having to tell you what is right or wrong. You have our blood; listen to the voice of the blood, listen to your intuition. Those of you who understand will guard the others, tell them what is right and wrong, and see to it that development happens as it shall."

"Is that your Guardians? But where are they? Where are these Guardians? I have sought them for years, but never found any!"

"Are you sure about that? The whole time you have searched for something you have had with you all along, in your own baggage. You must understand that you are a Guardian. A Guardian of life, a Guardian of the children of the gods. A Guardian of customs. A Guardian because you react to what is unfair and gruesome, a Guardian because you dare to travel up here, all alone, even to the gods to ask questions about our treatment of human kind. We can feel safe when we know that men are cared for by such as you, you will watch over them. You wish the best, not only for you, but for all of humanity. You will fight for people who would rather see you dead. You will fight for somebody who would fight to come first in line when you were to be stoned or hanged. You will fight for somebody who does not even deserve to lick your boots clean. But, albeit you will fight for them. You will fight because your own spirit says to you that; "forgive them, they do not know what they are doing". It is not their fault that they are like this, but you know that it is your responsibility to make their children to become something more - and then you must also fight for them. One can not hate a plant because it can not grow in dry sand, but one can take its seeds and plant them in fertile soil.

The female Guardians are too proud to defile themselves, the male too proud to lust for defiled women or others' wives. All the Guardians are noble, and always grow more noble as their lives stride forth. Some even crave answers from the gods, when they see the sufferings of man. And some get answers. Like you have today. The best of them become gods themselves, get to enter our halls and live with us like equals."


III

This was what I remembered. After this I had been led back to my room. I became sleepy and laid down to sleep. I was back in the mud, still just as battered and dying. But a young maiden had heard my cries and her parents came to my rescue. I survived. I got to live.

Oft I wonder if it all just was a dream, a dying man's delusions, but it hits me anyhow that they were totally right. The gods told me what was right. I got a whole new perspective on life, and I hope also that others will learn from what I have told. You can not smell what I smelled when I was there, you can not see what I saw, you can not know how my travel to the heavens was - but you can try to imagine.

And so it was that I found a guard in the end, that could show me the path to the gods and explain to me why the world was like it was. Why the old world had to end and be replaced with a new and a more healthy one. How you in your world got a hold of my story I do not know, and neither do I know how your world looks like, but I hope my story may help you know what you are going to do with and what you are going to do in that world you live in, so that man may prosper, grow and thrive in accordance with nature and the laws of the gods."

Varg Vikernes
Reply
:iconashkinmor:
Ashkinmor Featured By Owner Dec 18, 2013
In two words, please.
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 24, 2011
Correction: I did delete one comment from some troll who had some weird Republican Lara Croft foot fetish gallery. Dude gave me the creeps, so I didn't want him to linger around my comments section.
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2011
hahaha XD
weird Republican Lara Croft foot fetish gallery. made me laugh uncontrollably.
Reply
:iconn1raha:
N1raha Featured By Owner Oct 23, 2011  Hobbyist Photographer
Some of the people posting comments on here make me shake my head in sadness, but you have some amazing retorts.
Bravo :)




Viva la revolution!
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 23, 2011
Thank you!!! :)

I don't really blame them for their views and whatnot, I blame the media for trying to spook people into believing that we're just a bunch of crazy, drugged-out commies with nothing better to do but complain. They just believe what they see on tv or read on major news outlets, instead of meeting people at some of these events and talking to them and getting to know who they are and where they come from.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 20, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
I think it's outrageous how lazy people are trying to blame somebody else for their own bad life. You made the wrong (financial) decisions - why should somebody else pay? A similar thing is happening in Europe now. And the most probable result of all this is that the governments are going to realise that majority of population is stupid and needs control. And that we will have police states in a couple of ten years. Is this really what the protesters want? I doubt so. But in their close-mindedness they don't see what their actions are causing.
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2011
outrageous is how people take sides of the institutions that methodically enslave them. that is a very very sad flavor of close-mindedness.

and if we are stupid, we are stupid for letting this happen in the first palce - not for voicing opinions against it.

what's going on in europe is democracy at work - what happened in the uk (i understand why you are upset, really) with the vandalism was plain wrong (to say the very littlest)- i agree with you there, that such actions of destructive rage will only make things worse - but that was a completely different thing.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 26, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Ok yes, perhaps London was different that US. But I would say both come from the same rood - human greed and laziness. The english are just a worse-behaving nation perhaps, mainly when they get drunk :)
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 26, 2011
the way i understood it, people in london protested in front of a policestation to get a matter cleared up about a policeman killing a family father. they demanded to know how and why this happend. and they got ignored and then forced away. so they got even more upset and started venting. and this attracted all kinds of - for their own variety of reasons - upset and frustrated people, who in mob mentalities fell into blind vandalism and destructive behaviour.

and - as far as i can see - OWS is a peaceful protest of people who belief that mankind can find ways to operate society better than it currently does in this flawed banking- and monetary system.

... i wonder though, what would happend if everyone out on the streets would get shitfaced. wait, no, i'd rather not want to know XD
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 28, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Ok last news I heard yesterday there were fights with policemen, can't remember which city now.. and yes you are perhaps right about London - but the anger spread like fire to other cities. The sad thing is that with this behaviour people were damaging properties and shops of other fellow citizens who by no means belonged among the rich people.
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 28, 2011
yes, i agree - and sad is a very very mild word here.

if i try to comprehend what is going on in such a mind; there might be little going on, as a mob-environment tends to switch of what we generally refer to as thinking.

it is barbarism what happened (or happens?) with the firestarting and looting, damaging of shops, businesses and houses, etc.
and, aye, that's what i meant with it attracting all kinds of frustrated people. still, evicting families from their homes and taking away dreams of a stable retirement with imaginary number games and deliberately misleading contracts does not feel any less barbaric to me, no matter how "civilised" it can be made to look like.

as far as i know, was made to believe, there's been an interesting court rule in the united states, where a bank loan and the resulting mortgage demand of a bank were declared null because the bank admitted that the loaned money (credit) was never in their possession, but merely created on paper, demanded back in "real money" and the defendants property, his house.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 28, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
That is an interesting case. But isn't most of our money just made up? I mean as far as I know governments haven't backed up the money by real-world things like gold etc since WWI ? I definitely agree that this is wrong. But the solution to this problem is very complex and demands cooperation of countries as well as all classes of the society. It demands restructure of the way we think about money and work. So in my opinion these riots are just slowing everything down and making it worse.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 28, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
that is true my friend :D
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 28, 2011
yes, many yesses,- i almost completely agree - just one no at the end, because these protests do not slow things down or make it worse, because they make people think about the issues, make people partake in the discussion, will make politicians shape their campaigns to appeal to their picture of the upset, politically frustrated masses - and it got the two of us talking abuot it, for fuck's bloody sake! :D
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 20, 2011
New York City was already a police state years before the protests.

Also, I'm not going to say that many people don't make wrong financial decisions, it's a fact of life. But some of us are born into it, as our parents were, and even when we try our best to better our situation by going to college, getting a degree and a career; bank fees, interest rates, and the increase of cost of life in proportion to wages keep us forever crushed under the ruins of our broken dreams.

But hey, you're entitled to your own opinions and views, and even though I may disagree with them, I'll fight for your right to express them. Unlike our governments and police forces....
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 20, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Ok but even if you are 'born' to it you can work your way up if you try hard. I think the main problem with kids that have poor / unemployed parents is that they were tought this as a way of life. And they would rather complain than work on themselves. And college or university is not automatically going to improve anyone situation. Hard work is.

Further to the point, I think we do have good level of freedom of speech. All what the demonstrations (and even worse fights with the police in Europe, burning of London etc) are doing is working towards governments putting more and more restrictions on people because they need to be controlled. So people who never demonstrated and do work hard will suffer. Similarly how terrorists attacks degraded our freedom - longs checks at the airport, fear of going into tube (underground) etc.
Reply
:iconkaylakaster:
kaylakaster Featured By Owner Nov 6, 2011  Hobbyist Digital Artist
1. The people who work the hardest in this country are the people who make the least amount of money. I'm talking about miners, cleaning people, road construction workers, and people who work in fast food restaurants; people who perform hard physical labor. So hard work doesn't improve anyone's situation.

2. Nature does not bestow the same level of intelligence on everyone. If a person cannot learn, that is not their fault. Some people just plain and simply lack the mental capacity to learn beyond a certain level.

3. My mother works as an LPN - she works over time almost every week just to be able to pay rent, put food on the table and pay her portion of the medical insurance she gets through her employer - which costs her $250.00 a month for both of us.

4. Everyone living in this country has benefited from revolution - the American Revolution. Change never comes if no one ever tries. I say better to have tried and lost than never to have tried at all. By lumping everyone in the Occupy movement in a category of lazy, homeless bums looking for a handout, you conveniently excuse yourself from taking responsibility for the direction your country is heading.

5. There are a variety of motivating factors behind the Occupy movement, but the thing everyone in the movement agrees on is that WE NEED CHANGE
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Nov 6, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
1. Hard work does not necessarily mean hard physical work. Take scientists, teachers, even that banker that you hate who has to wake up at 5 am in the morning, make hard decisions the whole day and is completely exhausted at the end of the week. Plus to get a psychologically - harder job, you have to work hard at uni. So for me, people who actually don't work physically work harder - people with physical labor are either non that intelligent to go to uni or lazy, which means they have to work physically

2. That is true but they can still try hard. Most importantly, they cannot blame anyone else for their low intelligence and by extension they cannot demand more benefits than other people

3. So? Many people do it, that is life. At least she has freedom of speech etc, and is not prosecuted for what she is / beliefs. And she gets part of her insurance paid, that's great! When in the history of humanity did people care about each other as much as now and governments provided as many benefits as now?

4. I am still missing one thing in this movement - the right to protest. I don't that people have the right to claim free money because of their misfortune, sorry

5. What change? It's easy to say we need change but harder to come up with ideas. There is nobody who is pointing at what exactly needs to be done. It's easy to complain if you then expect others to find solutions
Reply
:iconkaylakaster:
kaylakaster Featured By Owner Nov 6, 2011  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Again, your post is full of assumptions.

You assume that I hate bankers. You assume that the Occupy participants want something for free, and again, you assume all Occupy participants are unintelligent and lazy.

When you stop assuming and start truly listening then you will be in a position to have meaningful debate.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Nov 6, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
I am sorry but you don't provide me with answers so I have to assume ;)
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 21, 2011
I come from a poor family from a shantytown in Puerto Rico, and my parents never taught me this was the way I was expected to live. I worked hard, set my goals, and became a NYC teacher and I'm still buried in debts from college that I will never be able to pay off in my lifetime. And hard work will not better anyone's situation if exploitation from the powers that be go unchecked. Ask any Mexican day laborer. They can show you a thing or two about hard work, and how they are continually being screwed over and kept in the bottom rung of the ladder.

I agree that some of the demonstrations in Europe have gotten out of hand, but it's not an excuse to let those in power push us around. Governments and corporations are like schoolyard bullies, picking on the little guys, pushing them around, seeing how far and how hard they can push someone until they break. But when that person pushes back, they will stop and think "Wait, maybe I better back off." It happened in the civil rights movements in the 60's, Women's Suffrage, hell even the independence of America. Sure, we're fighting a giant, but together we can show them we're just as big, if not bigger.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 22, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Well I have university depts as well but I pay them bit by bit from my every monthly salary. But I try not to create other depts for myself, I pay my credit card bills every month and generally do not borrow any money. I was quite poor myself when I was a student but worked my way up. Because I worked hard. I'm not saying you are not working hard but you must be doing something wrong if you still find yourself at the same spot as let's say a few years ago.

The thing with the other movements you mention is that they had a real goal that was fairly strictly defined. The movement of occupy wall street doesn't have this in my opinion. Everyone seems to say a different things, most of the people the media asked about why they were there didn't even know. The same goes for London demonstrations. It struck me really stupid when Londoner demonstrators were just happy they could loot something and get stuff for free. But, please correct me if I am wrong, do you guys actually have an agenda you are fighting for? Or are you just generally complaining about the society?
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 22, 2011
The media wants to distort the movement has being too unfocused or just a gathering of crazy ideals and whatnot, but if you spend a day at OWS, you notice the common theme: Corporate greed and Government suppression. Kind of like the protests of the 60's. Everyone was protesting against the war, but you had hippies saying we should love each other, Buddhists and people into Eastern religions preaching spirituality over war, Black Panthers and Young Lords saying how people of color should rise up and fight against the government, the list goes on. Occupy Wall Street is no different. Many of the problems in society today can all be traced back to the 1%. Rise of tuition costs, rise on the cost of life, foreclosures, unemployment, health expenses, outrageous bank fees, lack of development of alternative fuel sources, environmental destruction, it's all the work of the same monster. In the end it's the corporate world keeping the common person down through money, while the government protects and profits from the 1%.

As for me, I already discussed my background in the debate I had with WizardMaster2008 under this very same photo, so instead of retyping the story again, forgive me for the copy/paste:

"I ruined a college scholarship because I had to work a full time job in order to help my family and couldn't find time to take the required 12 credits per semester (My mom's a widow, my father was a Vietnam vet who blew his brains out, war must've fucked with his head, ol' man was a crazy bastard). I had to finance my college years through students loans to make it through. I graduated as a teacher and now am dealing with a college loan that will never go down because the interest rate is so jacked up that the balance has only gone down $800 in the last 10 years. Basically I'm just paying the interest and lost all hope of ever being able to pay it off. So my enemy is the cost of tuition and ridiculous fees and interest established by the banking institutions that are in charge of my student loan."

I also live in the New York City area, which is very, very expensive. Rent here is astronomical, so it's hard to keep up and build savings. If you ask me why I don't move I'll tell you it's because I still have the hope of becoming a photojournalist, and this city does offer opportunities for me as an artist. I'm still doing my best to rise up and better my life so I'm currently creating a portfolio, expanding my network of friends and connections, building up my photogear. I quit my job as a teacher recently in order to take on a job that allows me more time to pursue my art and allow me to do what I love. In the end it's all about finding true happiness and keeping my head above the shit that life may throw at me.
Reply
:iconelendurwen:
Elendurwen Featured By Owner Oct 23, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Ok - most of the things you list with money as a problem in the society are a consequence of the economical crisis - wouldn't you agree? I.e. of the fact that the banks turned one day and said they had no money anymore. So government later bailed them out. Now what money do you think was used for that? Your or mine small tax payments? Of course not. It is the big corporation that pay so much tax that the society still had at least some money, it is them that saved the economy when ordinary people were just deep in debt. More importantly, whose fault is the fall of economy? Of course it's the banks that gave away the money first of all but it is also the responsibility of each individual who took a loan with no plan of paying it back. Take student loans, mortgages, credit cards. It is people who are constantly in debt and have no means of paying it back who keep ruining the world's economy in my opinion. If you cannot afford the interest, don't take the 'free' money.

Secondly, you say it yourself, it is YOUR choice to live in NY. If it was really that bad you would move out. So as I see it you want to keep your artist life AND have money right from the beginning. It just doesn't work like that. I myself would love to just write or do music or draw but I realise I would never make a living out of it. That's why I studied programming and that's what I do for living. Having money now, I can afford doing all these arts in my spare time but I am sensible enough to know I would have never made if I was stubbornly saying I wanna do arts I wanna do arts. You chose to study for a teacher, that's your qualification now. That's what you are paying your loan for. If you didn't want to be a teacher you shouldn't have gone to that school and taken that loan in the first place. So I apologise, but I cannot see why you have the right to complain. I'm not saying don't pursue your dreams but in this economy making a living is the first things everyone should concentrate on. Fun doesn't come in the first place. And I'm not sure it ever did in the human society.
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2011
you have a misconception about bailout money - it's not tax money from anywhere - it is just another loan from yet another bank to a government, increasing national debt even further. creating "money" out of thin air, with nothing of tangible value to back it up - but draining even more money and power from governments in return.

figures about whether private indivuduals pay more or less (income+other) tax than big corporations pay taxes (that they do not get back, that is) might proove interesting actually. quite interesting.
Reply
(1 Reply)
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 24, 2011
Actually, many of the corporations that supposedly paid the most taxes are the ones who's CEO's and board members got the biggest tax breaks! Also, many of these corporations paid taxes only for the properties and gains in the US. But what about those who's products and services come from China, India, etc? They're exempt from tax! A perfect example would be Baxter Pharmaceuticals, who operate in many Latin American countries on tax-free deals, since it helps the economies of those countries, so they get a break from those governments. Why do you think many jobs move overseas? Cheap labor and tax beaks! The percent they do pay for tax in the US is almost non-existent compared to the massive profits they are raking in.

As for me, I had to move from New York to New Jersey because of the increase in rent. And right now New Jersey's rent is skyrocketing. I live in Union City, on the border of Hoboken and Jersey City. Hoboken is unlivable unless you're rich, Jersey City is starting to turn into a haven for rich yuppies. I work in New York City and can't afford to buy a car, pay for gas, insurance, repairs, etc. What am I supposed to do? Move farther and farther away until I'm in the middle of Kansas? I don't think NJ Transit buses go that far.

My teaching degree has served me well, I got my current job because of it (I educate tenants on housing laws and advocate for them), so it's not wasted money. I pursue my art in my spare time, and living very close to New York has allowed me to expand and grow as an artist. Don't get me wrong, I would never quit my day job, but why not pursue my dream when time allows? Also, if I didn't live close to New York, I would never have this chance to document this event and have my photos featured on CNN, as well as magazines from the UK, Puerto Rico, Spain, and Japan. You yourself have an impressive gallery, and I can easily see your work in books and magazines. But instead you're resigning yourself to a belief that life is all about work and dreams are just for fools.
Reply
(1 Reply)
:iconrichardwillis:
RichardWillis Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
No offense to the camera man, but dang these protestors.

O sure, lets get the rich all angry. It's not like they don't have the money to move to another capitalist nation and capitalize/spend their money there. That will leave us in much better shape I tell you!
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2011
(one of the) the problem(s) of the united states is that capital is drained out of it - it's not like it isn't already happening. open your eyes. every once in a while.
Reply
:iconrichardwillis:
RichardWillis Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
The rich still have money. My question is where would you like them to spend it: Here? Or would you rather them pack their bags and move to China or Canada or New Zealand and spend it there?

My point is if you chase them away, all we will have is the broke government.

When I say capitalize I mean start businesses, hire people, etc.
Reply
:icongerundium:
gerundium Featured By Owner Oct 25, 2011
the thing is, the "money" is usually in a bank account or portfolio - so 99.9034% of it is outside of the united states. already. in china, yes, for instance. heck, if i had my coupla bucks on an account at a larger bank than my tiny towns, my money would most likely be there too.

and local banks are more likely to give loans to local (start-up)businesses, yes : )
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011
k
Reply
:iconrichardwillis:
RichardWillis Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Why not occupy Hollywood? If you average the top 10 highest paid movie stars salaries, it comes out to around 100 million each year. The average for the top 10 CEO's on wall street is 46 million. The real corps that own the government (and the world for that matter) are not even banks, GE, Time-Warner, Disney, and a few others, literally own the media and probably the balls of all those folks protesting. And even then, the government surrendered all of our money to the banks knowing none of it would be returned, so why not protest at capital hill?

Since you are there do they have an agenda with a list of demands yet or is the media telling the truth and they really are just taking up space? Does anyone expect anything to happen from this?
Reply
Hidden by Owner
:iconrichardwillis:
RichardWillis Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
O! so the 99% is a product of divine intervention, and here I was thinking it was just people getting paid by labor unions to start something trendy and create a bandwagon marketing scheme to pull as many people out in the streets as possible in what appears to be some Nancy Pelosi scheme to pull attention away from the Tea Party movement. Silly me!
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011
*sigh* You obviously want a debate. Why don't you go to your nearest Occupy protest and do it there instead of in the comments section of someone's Deviantart gallery? I'm just a poor, humble photographer trying to make it through the day.
Reply
:iconrichardwillis:
RichardWillis Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
touche, lol, I have no answer. Look it's a good clean photo that portrays a clear message, my question remains though, to whom is the message intended and why? I understand you're not the right person to ask though and I took your advice. So I'll leave you be and wish you the best.
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011
Bah, as much as I tried to dismiss you, I felt that I owed you an answer to your question. After all, you did take the time to look at my photo and respond to it, and I appreciate that. I guess being a true artist is about responding to both praise and criticism. Sorry if I was being asshole-ish before, guess it's the New Yorker in me coming out.

Anyways,I can offer you my reason for supporting the movement, and based on the photo, you can kinda do the math. I ruined a college scholarship because I had to work a full time job in order to help my family and couldn't find time to take the required 12 credits per semester (My mom's a widow, my father was a Vietnam vet who blew his brains out, war must've fucked with his head, ol' man was a crazy bastard). I had to finance my college years through students loans to make it through. I graduated as a teacher and now am dealing with a college loan that will never go down because the interest rate is so jacked up that the balance has only gone down $800 in the last 10 years. Basically I'm just paying the interest and lost all hope of ever being able to pay it off. So my enemy is the cost of tuition and ridiculous fees and interest established by the banking institutions that are in charge of my student loan.

Hope that offers some sort of answer to the enigma of the photo and once again, I apologize for my attitude, we New Yorkers are a rude bunch but deep inside we have a heart of gold.
Reply
(1 Reply)
:iconlaughing-phoenix:
Laughing-Phoenix Featured By Owner Oct 18, 2011   Digital Artist
V for Vendetta is one of my favorite graphic novels of all time! I was wondering if any protesters were wearing that mask. Thanks for the uploading this photo. And may the movement continue.
Reply
:iconradio-schizo:
Radio-Schizo Featured By Owner Oct 19, 2011
Thank you! :)
Reply
Add a Comment:
 
×




Details

Submitted on
October 5, 2011
Image Size
3.4 MB
Resolution
3168×4752
Link
Thumb
Embed

Stats

Views
1,766
Favourites
47 (who?)
Comments
61
Downloads
56

Camera Data

Make
Canon
Model
Canon EOS 50D
Shutter Speed
1/64 second
Aperture
F/5.0
Focal Length
28 mm
ISO Speed
100
Date Taken
Oct 5, 2011, 5:58:36 AM
Lens
EF28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM
Sensor Size
15mm
×